Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Ok, so I've never been a 'gun guy'. BUT I picked up my first hand gun (Springfield XD-9 9mm) about 6 months ago for home protection. When I went looking, I did some research and went to the gun shop for a couple hours. Spoke to the guys there to try to make the best decision with the little knowledge I had. I left with spending a couple hundred dollars more than I planned, but I am happy with my decision.

Now I want to pick up a shotgun, as well as a rifle. I am looking for general home protection and the occasional hunting (never hunted before). I am looking to spend under $400 for a shotgun, and not much more for a rifle. I know that is a bit limited, but after just making the move up north, we've been living on just my income for now (wife starts her job in a couple weeks).

I found this place that's close and seems to have reasonable prices... http://maine-guns.com/sales.html. Anyone have any experience with any guns on there that would be worth the money. The Mossberg Talo Breecher Tactical Shotgun 12ga 18.5" for $360 looks pretty good, but I don't know if it would be any good for hunting. If nothing here looks decent, anyone have any advice for a good 'beginner' shotgun/rifle that won't break the bank and I'll have some money left over for ammo? ;) Also, maybe sourcing a used piece would save some coin as well, if you have any recommendations on what to look for.

Thanks!

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Remmington 870 express 12 gauge shotgun. $300 new and right now they have a $30 rebate on them. Would be around $225 for a used one. Great reliable guns and are a basic entry level gun. Good for hunting and protection if needed.

I wouldnt get a tactical shotgun for your first shotgun. #1 they are ment for fast action and if you dont know how to handle them properly you might accidently shoot it off and #2 I dont really think they would be good for hunting.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Rem 870 w/ deer barrel, turkey barrel and full choke barrel (as a package if you can find it). And a 22LR semi auto. Cheap, abundant ammo, quiet shockwave.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

BUY: Mossberg 500 with 2 barrels: rifled (for deer) and smooth (for home defense, bird shooting). You can use that gun for deer, bird, and rabbit hunting.

The Remington 870 also has a package that comes with 2 barrels, but is slightly more expensive.

18.5'' probably isn't enough for hunting, that's more of a defense shotgun.



Edit: They have that Mossberg 500 right on that page you linked.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

All the above are excellent advise.

Shotgun first, because is fits most what you need. First home protection, a shotgun has the most utility with a short barrel, and with a rifled barrel and different ammo (all universally available), you have the BEST home protection and limited capability to hunt. 100 to 150 yards max unless you are really good.

The two to consider are the Remington 870, and the Mossberg 500 series. Easy to find used is a big plus.

Next IMHO is a 22 rifle.

Then (again IMHO) a short range rifle like a 30-30 or AK/SKS. I would lean to the AK, and as TA states the Saiga is the most for you money with one small disavantage. The Saiga 7.62x39 has a proprietary magazine/clip and will not fit the universal AK magazine


Buy locally if at all possible. See what you are getting.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Remington 870 and a 22 cal rifle....all you need. This is the foundation. Get a 38 snubby for carry in public.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Exactly the information I was looking for. Thanks for the help everyone!

Can you tell me where you saw them at this price with the rebate? Thanks.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

I concur on the 870....reliable, common, almost universally known in CONUS, reasonably priced. I don't know anything about the Mossbergs. If you ever need parts, the more common the gun the more likely you'll find them.

I'm not partial to Commie rifles, something just goes against the grain for me. Consider a good used Garand in good old 30-06.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Today's Big 5 ad. Regular price 399.99, sale price 329.99, after 30 mail in rebate 299.99.

http://big5sportinggoods.shoplocal.c...820510&offerid=

They are also advertizing a Mossberg 590 reg 419.99 fpr 339.99.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Yeah I forgot about that ..........

But you can pick up 30 round clips none the less fairly easy.

These guys seem pretty good

http://www.mississippiautoarms.com/i...ex&cPath=25_31

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Here's the remington 870 combo...I have it and like it.

http://www.remington.com/products/fi...gnum_combo.asp

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Jeeez, enough with the 870 already!!
ust to be different....get one of these:

http://www.dreadgazebo.com/gunporn/?p=218

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Good stuff......... I didnt know they made a 870 with a 7 round capcity with a smalll barrell (18.5.)

May have to check that one out.

T

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Two words for you: Uncle Henry's...google it and search under Firearms. Or try Kittery Tradin post in Kittery.

Can't go wrong with a Rem. 870 or Mossberg.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Uncle Henry's...my new found love. Thanks Dutch, I think I already found a used 870 for under $200 with my name on it.

Thanks again everyone!

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Remington 870 safety I don't like for home defense. Down on the trigger guard.....now is it punched to the left or the right to fire ?

Real quick, you guys that own them for that, which way is it...Can you remember without looking ???.....it's dark....you can't see the button with the red showing and you don't have time to be flipping it to the side to see it anyway....you need to SHOOT RIGHT NOW....which way is it again ??.......guess wrong......lose seconds.....and maybe your life. If you're duck hunting, no big deal.....another duck will be by shortly.......mistakes allowed. Home defense, way fewer mistakes allowed. WHY BUY SOMETHING WITH A POTENTIAL MISTAKE BUILT IN ?????????

Mossberg: Safety on top....Thumb flick "Forward To Fire".....no guessing....light doesn't matter.....

That ONE FEATURE alone should make you buy the Mossberg for defense.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Leaving it in fire position with a round in the chamber is a great way to lose a foot. Most common mistake for untrained/semi-trained/occasional shooter type folks is their INABILITY to keep their DAMN finger off the trigger and on the outside of the trigger guard ( they call them TRIGGER GUARDS FOR A REASON PEOPLE ) until the actual time to fire. Bump into a coffee table in the dark.....KaBoom.

I've trained quite a few people the basics of shooting.....every single one of them I've thumped in the back of the head more than one time to KEEP THEIR FINGER OFF THE TRIGGER until ready to actually shoot.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Another good site for home defense or shotgun enthusiasts. I forget who first posted it, I'm just passing it on.

http://badexample.mu.nu/archives/073642.php

Now I'm off to Walmart for more 00 Buckshot and clay pigeons.

My surefire is in the mail...Will give feedback in a week or so.

http://www.lapolicegear.com/sure870we.html


Git er done:5_1_120:

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

I will go to school on that one...good point.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

A safety set on an active defensive weapon?

Are you nuts?

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Shotgun safeties are a matter of personal preference...

My 870 safety is right where it should be--near the tip of my trigger finger--and the safety always moves in the same direction...push it off to fire, RIGHT-TO-LEFT, natural as can be for a right-hander. Been that way since Remington first introduced the 870, back in 1950.

You can even tell if the safety is on as you slide your finger onto the trigger...by the way, the safety is always OFF with my "up-close-and-personal" shotgun...simply rack and BANG.

And yes, if I hear a loud noise in the night...and my dog is screaming like a banshee...and I go to investigate, you can be sure at some point my finger is on the trigger.

Stay alive and stay safe...

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

From http://badexample.mu.nu/archives/073642.php

Some wisdom for people with shotguns for home defensive that bears repeating. When people talk about the "aftermarket" accessories for a shotgun, most times they are wasting their $

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

KTP (been there 100's of times when I was a kid growing up in Rye, NH) has a HUGE selection, but kind of pricey these days.

My opinion is the MOSSBERG 500, preferabley a "mariner" or Marine COte, preferably with a full sythetic stock (if ur a newbie to guns)(easier to keep your finger off the trigger with a full stock).

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Mossberg 500 series, or Remington 870 series. Preferably short-barreled with extended ammunition tube.

If you want to look more "innocuous," choose a wood stock...if you want "tactical advantage" (or just to show off), choose a plastic (black) stock.

You should be able to do the gun, a sling, a spotlight, and minimal ammunition for under $400...probably a lot less if you shop around.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

For home defense I have ready an AR-15 with tactical scope and sure-fire light ready to go. My safety is off. If my alarm goes off, I will then chamber the round and check the situation.

If you heard someone in your house, I presume you take the safety off right away?

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

With my 870, which is the long gun I use to clear the house, the safety starts in the ON position. It is stored that way with a full magazine and an empty chamber. I chamber a round when I retrieve the 870. The safety is still on at that time. The safety is switched off as I go to low ready and move my trigger finger alongside the trigger guard. It happens in the same motion with the index finger which is one reason I really like the 870 safety. I do not move my finger to the trigger until I have the gun mounted with a target identified. If the house is clear, the gun is lowered and made safe.

Like I mention in all of these threads, a good class is worth the time and money. The Thunder Ranch shotgun class is worth the price. The Urban rifle class is also a great investment. The number of rounds fired in each class under conditions that are quite stressful makes for a great learning experience.

BTW, my house 870 is a stock 18" 870P (Remington SKU 4449) with a solid Speedfeed synthetic rear stock, Remington LE forend, and ghost ring (Wilson rear and XS front) sights. It is choked IC. It is still equipped the same way. Nothing has been added to it but the wear from lots of rounds. The 18" 870P in my vehicle has a Knoxx Spec-Ops stock so I have a shorter LOP (more layers of clothing) and some recoil reduction for those slugs but is otherwise stock. It is also choked IC. My trap gun is an 870TB and my bird gun is an 870SP, so I have lots of repetition and experience with the 870 system.

If you get a synthetic stocked shotgun, make sure the stock is solid and not hollow. Your shoulder will thank you, and the stock will be much more durable.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

From Ag Man's post:

"Those super-long magazine tubes add nothing useful. If we can't do it with four or five rounds, we can't do it. Furthermore, those extra-long magazine springs have a tendency to kink, tying up the gun."

Is that true? I've never heard that before. I just got a 870 with a 6 or 7 round magazine ( can't remember! ), haven't shot it yet.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

The biggest issue I have seen with magazine extensions has been with the spring or follower getting caught on the joining of the factory tube and the extension. I have also seen extensions that bend, causing issues, especially ones installed without the additional hanger. The springs on the tubes with extensions do not seem to last as long, causing feeding issues.

The only extension I have ever trusted was a Remington factory-installed extension. I prefer to not have an extension since it makes take down for maintenance easier and is less likely to cause issues.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

If you don't practice with either one, you deserve what you get.

For the Remington for right hand on the trigger, flat to fire. Light doesn't matter.

(I thought the Mossberg was "back to boom")

If you don't practice, you deserve what you get.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

I don't have an aftermarket extension on my 870, like Farscott, I bought mine with a factory 7 round tube. Never had a problem with it. BTW, I don't agree with the author of the article that I posted when he says, if you cant do it with 4 or 5 rounds, "we can't do it". Higher capacity is a good thing, as long as the magazine is dependable.

With regard to the Rem 870 vs. the Mossberg 500, I own both. I'd give the Rem a plus over the Mossy, in that it just feels like a higher quality shotgun. Which it should, as it sells for more $. Get the best deal you can, both are great shotguns.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

I agree ..........you can never have too much ammo.


T

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Well looks like I'll be going to pick this up in a couple days...

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v474/doitdub/gun2.jpg

Looks like a good deal, from a private seller about an hour from my place.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Could just load the magazine tube.....and do not chamber a round.....leave gun on "fire"....rack one in - good to go.

I do not like the idea of keeping a shotgun with rounds in the mag around the house....we have kids.

We keep our pistols in several small safes around the house....loaded.....easy to open with a few key strokes.....

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

This weekend, I ran into a friend that won a N.E.F. / H&R "Pardner" 20 ga pump shotgun at a Ducks Unlimited Dinner. It is a Compact Model...which I think means Youth Model....has a 13 in pull...so just a bit shorter than 14.5 inch for typical shotgun...has a 20 inch barrel. Screw in choke tubes.

Overall, a nice looking, handy little shotgun...easy to use by youths and women...I gave $100 for it...and it is new.

Looks like you can buy them retail around $200 ish....

Overall - youth model shotguns are outstanding choice to use in a home defense gun....so - it is a little bit short....that makes them hands. Ever look into Clyde (Bonnie & Clyde) Barker's modifications....he called them "whip-it" guns....easy to whip out and use....very short stocks and barrels.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

$175 is a very decent price for a like-new 870 Express...

If it comes with a modified choke, you might also pick up an IC and Full choke for more added versatility...or not.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Are you serious? Clear the house with a long gun? If you want to barricade yourself in one room and cover the door, fine but do not try to clear a house with a long gun.

Explain to me how you go thru a doorway or turn around quickly in a hallway. A long gun must be pointed up or down to turn around in a hallway. When entering a room the barrel is either up or down [useless] or ahead of you which allows the perp to grab the barrel. If the perp grabs the barrel and pulls you are going to lose the gun or be pulled over/off balance.

All you are going to get is a wrestling match with some perp over your gun.

Please reconsider your plans. A handgun can be held in the right hand at waist level close to your body. Use the left hand to hold a light, open doors or keep a perp at arms length while you blow holes in his gut.

Here is a web page with a fairly comprehensive description of how to clear a house.
http://www.wikihow.com/Clear-a-Building-With-a-Firearm

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

You make a good point. Home defense implies a number of scenarios, each of which must be considered on a case-by-case basis. You must think things through ahead of time and plan your responses. If someone is trying to come through the front door or tries to kick in the back door, I have time to respond with shotgun or handgun.

If my outside dog is barking frantically as she sometimes does, then I am assuming the threat is OUTSIDE...either four-legged (javelina, coyote, bobcat, even mountain lion) as well as two-legged, and grab my shotgun.

For my first-response weapon--in my rather small house--I would grab the Glock which is within easy reach of my bed. If I need to barricade the door or step outside...the short-barrelled, short-stocked, fast-handling 870 loaded with #1 buck.

Re: Need input... (shotgun, or rifle - limited income)
 

Yes, I am serious. Yes, I have done it; it is how I train. I do keep a pistol (actually, more than one) for backup, but the 870 is easier to use. I have cleared homes (and not just in training) with just a 1911, and I really did not like it. I carry the shotgun at low ready, but not vertical. It comes up if I need it, but I have no issues with shooting someone in the foot. But I never lead the way through the door. The dogs go first and are good at flushing people out of their hidey holes.

BTW, a disarm with a handgun is no harder than a disarm with a long gun if you know the tricks. Training and practice are key here. Retention should also be something that is learned and practiced.

The wiki you reference specifically mentions using a shotgun to do the clearing.